On this "Face the Nation" broadcast, moderated by Margaret Brennan:
- John Kirby, National Security Council spokesperson
- Sen. Chris Van Hollen, Democrat of Maryland
- Democratic Maryland Gov. Wes Moore
- Rep. French Hill, Republican of Arkansas
- Avril Benoit, Doctors Without Borders executive director, and Janti Soeripto, Save the Children president
Click here to browse full transcripts of "Face the Nation."
MARGARET BRENNAN: I'm Margaret Brennan in Washington.
And this week on Face the Nation: Six months to the day Hamas attacked Israel, there is breaking military and diplomatic news in the conflict that has cost tens of thousands of lives.
Overnight, in a surprise development, the Israeli military has pulled many of their troops out of Southern Gaza. Is the move signaling a new phase of the conflict? We have got the latest.
And the outrage following the killing of seven World Central Kitchen humanitarian aid workers by the Israeli military in Gaza has led President Biden to change course in his dealing with Prime Minister Netanyahu. But will it be enough to change the course of Israel's war?
We will also delve into the impact of this war on aid workers and children in the Israel-Hamas conflict with Avril Benoit from Doctors Without Borders and Save the Children President Janti Soeripto.
In light of the upcoming negotiations to secure the release of the hostages held by Hamas in Cairo, we will speak with Rachel Goldberg-Polin. Her son Hersh has been in captivity for six months.
Furthermore, the city of Baltimore is actively engaged in cleanup operations and gearing up for the challenging task of rebuilding after the collapse of the Key Bridge. Maryland Governor Wes Moore will provide the latest updates.
Stay tuned for more on Face the Nation.
Good morning, and thank you for joining us on Face the Nation.
This morning brings breaking news from Israel. The IDF has withdrawn some forces from Southern Gaza, and Prime Minister Netanyahu has declared they are on the brink of victory.
Additionally, Israeli representatives are headed to Cairo for discussions with CIA Director Bill Burns, as well as officials from Qatar and Egypt, aiming to secure a cease-fire and negotiate the release of over 130 hostages reportedly held by Hamas.
We begin with our Holly Williams, who's in Tel Aviv.
How is that affecting things?
HOLLY WILLIAMS: Well, Margaret, we actually just heard from Prime Minister Netanyahu a short while ago ahead of a Cabinet meeting here in Israel.
He didn't mention this troop movement at all. In fact he vowed that Israel would fight for total victory. But he is under enormous pressure. Just as this news came out about these troops leaving Gaza, there's also pressure from the right wing on Netanyahu not to give away too much to Hamas in negotiations.
And then, on the other side of the political spectrum, last night, across Israel, tens of thousands of people took part in anti-government protests. Many people here are angry with the government, with their own leaders for not doing more to bring the remaining hostages home.
And here in Tel Aviv, a car rammed into a group of protesters, injuring several people. And opposition leader Yair Lapid said that the incident was – quote – "the direct result of rising incitement from the government," so more criticism there for Benjamin Netanyahu – Margaret.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Holly Williams in Tel Aviv, thank you.
And we turn now to John Kirby. He is the coordinator for strategic communications for the White House National Security Council.
Welcome back.
JOHN KIRBY (White House National Security Communications Advisor): Thanks, Margaret.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, Prime Minister Netanyahu says, Israel is one step away from victory, but they still plan to go into Rafah.
Has Netanyahu agreed to President Biden's request to make this targeted, and not a ground assault?
JOHN KIRBY: We have been very clear with the Prime Minister and his team that we don't support a ground operation in Rafah, that there are other ways, other options that they need to look at for how they're going to go after the Hamas threat that still is in Rafah.
We had a virtual meeting last week. We expect to have an in-person meeting with Israeli counterparts in the next week or so – we're still narrowing down the schedule – where we hope to be able to present in more detail our thinking, some of our alternatives, the kinds of things that we want them to learn from our own experiences about how to do operations of this regard.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, as you heard, the IDF says this is an evolution of the war to draw down some of these troops.
What exactly is the purpose of their preparations? Could this be for another aspect of the ongoing conflict?
JOHN KIRBY: I cannot comment on the IDF's operations or their planning in any way.
MARGARET BRENNAN: They haven't informed the U.S.?
JOHN KIRBY: It is their Military sovereignty.
The information we have received from them this morning suggests that this is primarily a period of rest and reorganization for troops who have been continuously deployed for four months and now need a break. What they intend to do with these troops after this period, I cannot say.
I can only reiterate what I mentioned earlier. We do not endorse a significant ground operation in Rafah. That stance remains unchanged. We are eager to engage in discussions with the Israelis regarding alternatives to such operations.
MARGARET BRENNAN: There has been significant criticism and doubt regarding Israel's conduct in this conflict following the recent deaths of seven humanitarian workers.
JOHN KIRBY: Indeed.
MARGARET BRENNAN: On Tuesday, you stated that the U.S. has not identified any instances where Israel has breached international law.
How extensive is the U.S. inquiry into Israel's actions?
The U.S. State Department's Assessment of Israel's Actions
During a recent interview, John Kirby from the U.S. State Department discussed the ongoing assessment of Israel's actions in partner countries. Kirby mentioned that the State Department is reviewing incidents in real-time and assessing them against international law. While some cases have been concluded, others are still under review. Kirby emphasized that there is no indication of a violation of international humanitarian law so far, but the matter is being taken seriously.
When asked about the secretary-general of Doctors Without Borders' rejection of Israel's explanation for the World Central Kitchen attack, Kirby acknowledged the concerns raised.
Doctors Without Borders Responds to Attacks in Gaza
Margaret Brennan highlighted the loss of staff in Gaza, including more than 200 deaths among humanitarians. Christopher Lockyear, the Secretary-General of Doctors Without Borders, expressed disbelief in Israel's explanation, stating that the attacks on World Central Kitchen, MSF's convoys, and shelters are part of a larger pattern of deliberate attacks on various groups, including health workers, journalists, and U.N. personnel.
Accountability Urged in Aid Operations
This is not just about implementing an effective deconfliction mechanism. Our movements and locations are shared, coordinated and identified already. This is about impunity, a total disregard for the laws of war, and now it must become about accountability.
(End VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: This isn't a mistake, he says; this is a deliberate pattern.
And he is not the only aid organization to say so.
JOHN KIRBY: Well, we certainly understand…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Will there be accountability?
JOHN KIRBY: We understand the frustration that they have.
We share that frustration. And there have been too many aid workers killed by Israeli operations.
And that is why the president was so firm with Prime Minister Netanyahu in their call this week about they've got to change the way they're doing this. And the deconfliction process does matter, because there is already communication between aid workers and the IDF.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And he said, it's pointless, it's not working…
JOHN KIRBY: Clearly, this – clearly…
MARGARET BRENNAN: It's clearly failing.
JOHN KIRBY: Clearly, this broke down, no question about it. We're not arguing that it hasn't.
We're – our case to the Israelis is, you got to do more.You got to do it better. It's got to improve, because we've already seen some aid organizations now pulling back, not just World Central Kitchen, but others.
This is a time when the people of Gaza need food, water, medicine, fuel, more than any.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
JOHN KIRBY: So…
MARGARET BRENNAN: But the President's own national security memorandum stipulates, as you know, that there can't be an impediment to delivery of aid.
So is negligence, gross negligence, failure to communicate, failure to follow through to protect these aid workers a violation? Is there any accountability?
JOHN KIRBY: Certainly – certainly, those things are not acceptable.
And, again, that was the – the tenor and the tone of the conversation that the prime minister – I'm sorry – the president had with the prime minister. They have taken some measures of accountability here in the immediate wake of the – of the World Central Kitchen…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Two soldiers.
JOHN KIRBY: Two – two were fired.
We're going to be looking to see – well, first of all, we're going through the investigation ourselves right now. We want to reserve judgment till we've had a chance to look at their findings. And we certainly expect – and this is an important point – that the announcements the Israelis have made, while welcome and important, can't be the end of it.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Mm-hmm.
JOHN KIRBY emphasized the need for sustained changes in the way operations are conducted on the ground and ensuring humanitarian assistance can flow without interference.
MARGARET BRENNAN raised the point that the Israeli government claims the measures were already planned, independent of the president's calls.
JOHN KIRBY countered, stating that the president specifically requested the measures announced by Israel later on, indicating a direct influence.
MARGARET BRENNAN expressed skepticism, saying, "We'll see if they follow through."
Former Defense Secretary Leon Panetta, in a CNN interview, remarked, "In the past, in my experience, the Israelis usually fire and then ask questions."
The discussion then turned to whether the Biden administration still holds the position of providing military aid to Israel without any conditions.
JOHN KIRBY declined to speculate on future decisions by the president regarding aid to Israel, emphasizing the need for policy changes in Gaza and military operations.
MARGARET BRENNAN pressed further, questioning if these policies are indeed leading to aid blockages.
JOHN KIRBY: No question. I mean, the…
MARGARET BRENNAN: So what is the U.S. policy, other than wait and see?
JOHN KIRBY: It's not wait and see.
I would have to take issue with – with that. That is not the policy at all. Two things can be true at once. You can still be a friend of Israel and make sure that they have what they need to defend themselves. And they do need things. I mean, we're talking about the war in Gaza, rightly so. Completely understand that.
But they're under threat. They live in a tough neighborhood. They're under threat…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Absolutely.
JOHN KIRBY: … from Iran and Iran-backed groups all around. They still have a need to defend themselves.
How they do that matters.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
JOHN KIRBY: The manner in which these operations are carried out is crucial. Our discussions with them are centered around this. If we do not see changes in their approach, we will have to reconsider our support.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Is there a deadline for them to take action? Because these...
JOHN KIRBY: We are currently assessing the situation. They did make some announcements shortly after our discussion. They also made additional announcements the following day regarding opening up crossings. While these are positive steps, we will be closely monitoring the situation. It must be consistent and verifiable.
MARGARET BRENNAN: John Kirby, thank you for joining us.
Continuing the conversation, we now speak with Democratic Senator Chris Van Hollen from Maryland.
Good morning, Senator.
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN (D-Maryland): Good morning, Margaret.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I'd like to delve into the ongoing discussion about the evolving policy. You have been urging the White House to adhere to the president's national security standards and to hold Israel accountable, potentially by conditioning military assistance.
Do you have a clear understanding of the White House's stance?
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: I am not certain.
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: But the president and the White House have yet to lay out what consequences they have and they want to impose. And we have had a situation where, for months, the president has made requests to the Netanyahu government, they have ignored those requests. And we've sent more 2,000-pound bombs. We cannot revert back to that. We have to make sure that, when the president requests something, that we have a means to enforce it. The president has the power to put limits on arms delivery to any country in the world that receives U.S. military support, even things that were approved by Congress in the past.
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: They get $3.3 billion a year to buy weapons, $500 million more a year for missile defense. You voted, along with other senators, on an additional $14 billion in aid. It's held up in the House right now. Is any of that being reconsidered? Well, first of all, that – that $14 billion was part of a much larger assistance...
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: … package that provided $60 billion to the people of Ukraine to fight against Putin.
So what I have said, is once monies are appropriated, you still have to go through this process to actually transfer them.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Mm-hmm.
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: And the president's own National Security Memorandum Number 20 that you just raised with John Kirby says very specifically that, if a recipient of U.S. military assistance, including the Netanyahu government, is restricting the delivery of humanitarian aid, that we should not be sending more weapons.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: And so it's very important that the Biden administration enforce its own policy that was signed by the president of the United States as a directive to the government. It needs to be enforced.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, when I have talked to folks who would be asked to implement the policy that you are talking about, in trying to say, OK, you can have defensive, but not offensive weapons, they say, it's next to impossible to try to separate that out and to define which weapons are OK and which weapons are not.
How do you respond to that?
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: There's a very clear line here.
I was very involved in the negotiation of NSM-20.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Mm-hmm.
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: Defensive weapons are things like air defense, Iron Dome. We're not taking the position that we should not be sending Israel systems that it needs to defend itself.
But offensive weapons, I mean, airplanes, bombs, artillery, everything that's being used right now in Gaza, these are offensive weapons that are being used. And so what it says is that you shouldn't be shipping more weapons to the Netanyahu government when they're not meeting their commitments, including the delivery of humanitarian aid, or if they're not complying with international law.
Should it be made public whether or not they're violating international law?
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: Yes. We need more transparency.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Will the White House commit – have you asked the White House to do that?
During the recent discussion, Senator Chris Van Hollen emphasized the importance of ensuring that Israel complies with the terms set by NSM-20 and meets President Biden's requests before approving weapons systems. He highlighted the need for a two-way partnership, indicating that the Netanyahu government must implement changes to allow more humanitarian assistance. Senator Van Hollen stressed the significance of measuring progress by tangible outcomes such as preventing starvation, ensuring access to medical equipment, and addressing healthcare needs. The conversation underscored the ongoing efforts to improve conditions and the necessity of meeting specific benchmarks before moving forward.
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: We must reconsider sending additional offensive weapons to Israel. Our goal is not to permanently halt them, but to effectively utilize our influence. This is the action we urge the President of the United States to take.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I must inquire about the situation in your home state of Maryland and the crisis in Baltimore.
Congressman Trone of Maryland proposed that the bill committing federal aid to reconstruct the bridge should be safeguarded against potential actions by President Trump. He mentioned structuring the appropriations bill with this in mind, in case President Biden is not reelected.
Do you share his apprehensions?
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: Firstly, President Biden has been actively involved in this issue from the start.
President Biden has already ensured that Maryland is included in the Emergency Relief Program, guaranteeing that the state will receive 90 percent of the necessary funds for bridge reconstruction.
Senator Cardin, Congressman Mfume, and I will introduce legislation to cover the remaining 10 percent and specify that any funds obtained through liability lawsuits will be returned to the U.S. federal taxpayer.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I will seek Governor Moore's insights on this matter.
Thank you, Senator Van Hollen.
SENATOR CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: Thank you.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Face the Nation will return shortly. Please stay tuned.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: For more on the recovery following last month's collapse of Baltimore's Francis Scott Key Bridge and the plan to rebuild it, we're joined now by Maryland Governor Wes Moore.
GOVERNOR WES MOORE (D-Maryland): Thank you so much. Thanks for having me.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And we are so sorry about the recovery and the fatal accident.
How do you describe where we are in this process of recovery and potentially rebuilding?
GOVERNOR WES MOORE: Well, I think, first, that the state is still heartbroken.
We lost six Marylanders. Just yesterday, we recovered the body of – of Maynor Sandoval. And – and our hearts continue to be with the families, and with all of the families. But we also know that we've got a long road to recovery ahead of us. But that road and that recovery is now happening.
You know, the – the – the enormity of this collapse cannot be overstated. We – we are literally talking about a – a ship that is the size of the Eiffel Tower and the weight of the Washington Monument that is now sitting in the middle of the Patapsco River with a bridge that is just iconic.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Mm-hmm.
GOVERNOR WES MOORE: I don't know what the Baltimore skyline looks like without the Key Bridge. It's been there since I have been alive.
And it's now sitting in the bottom of the river…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Mm-hmm.
GOVERNOR WES MOORE: … with part of it sitting on top of the ship.
So, the recovery is going to be long. But the resilience that we have seen from the people of our state and the people of the city of Baltimore has been inspiring, where we've really rallied.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So – we heard when the president visited that reiteration of a pretty aggressive timeline, though, to get things up and running again, perhaps even by the end of May.
Is that realistic?
GOVERNOR WES MOORE: It's – it's realistic. And I think that it's going to take something that's going to be a 24/7 operation, which is…
MARGARET BRENNAN: To have full functioning?
GOVERNOR WES MOORE: To have full functioning.
And – and that means being able to not just – not just continue the maritime operations that we have. And, also, it's understanding how important that port is, not just to Baltimore, but to the entire country. And, right now, if you look at the Port of Baltimore, we have operations that are taking place via truck and via rail.
It's just the – it's the maritime operations that have come to a halt. But we are going to do everything in our power to make sure we're bringing closure and comfort to these families, to be able to reopen this channel, to be able to support our workers and to support families who have been impacted by it, and also begin the process of the rebuild of the bridge.
It is an aggressive timeline, but we are going to work around the clock to make sure that we hit this timeline.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I read – all right, I have more to talk about with you, but I need to take a commercial break. So, please stay here with us.
And hope all of you will stay with us as well. Back in a moment.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: We want to recognize one of our favorite renaissance men, the legendary Bob Schieffer.
Since leaving the moderator's seat here at Face the Nation, Bob has been fine-tuning his artistic skills. And his work is now being featured at a solo exhibition that opened yesterday at American University here in Washington. The 25 paintings on display were inspired by recent headlines, from the COVID pandemic to the January 6 attack on the Capitol.
And the exhibition is on display until May 19.
We will be right back.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Welcome back to FACE THE NATION.
We continue our conversation with the governor of Maryland, Wes Moore.
GOVERNOR WES MOORE: The cost of the damage is still unknown at this time. However, it is crucial to recognize the significant impact of the Port of Baltimore on the national economy, generating $70 billion in economic activity. The Key Bridge serves as a vital link for over 36,000 daily commuters, connecting them to their homes, workplaces, places of worship, and schools. This tragedy extends beyond the local region and has far-reaching national implications.
The Port of Baltimore plays a key role in the transportation of new cars, heavy trucks, agricultural equipment, spices, and sugars, making it the largest port in the country for these goods. It is essential for us to come together in a bipartisan manner to ensure the timely and effective reconstruction of the bridge.
MARGARET BRENNAN: President's commitment to using federal funds for the bridge's reconstruction is reassuring. Additionally, holding accountable those responsible for the damage and ensuring they contribute to the repair costs is a crucial step forward.
How will the financial aspect be handled? Will taxpayers provide the initial funds and then be reimbursed by insurance claims? How will this process unfold?
GOVERNOR WES MOORE: That's correct. The president has assured us that this will be a nationwide effort to address a national tragedy. Accountability is crucial, and those responsible must be held accountable for their actions.
An independent NTSB investigation is currently underway. It is imperative that this investigation is both prompt and thorough. If individuals are found to be at fault, they must face the consequences of their actions.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However, the legal process is not known for its speed. The owners and managers of the ship have sought to limit their liability to $44 million. Do you believe they will ultimately be held financially responsible?
GOVERNOR WES MOORE: We anticipated that outcome and were ready for it. An independent investigation will be conducted, and if they are found responsible, they must assist in the cleanup.
MARGARET BRENNAN: President Biden mentioned that U.S. steel and union labor will be utilized for the reconstruction during his visit to the port on Friday. Can progress be made swiftly under these conditions?
GOVERNOR WES MOORE: It's crucial that we adhere to a well-defined plan for timely and cost-effective reconstruction. Our track record in Maryland demonstrates our commitment to labor and unions, ensuring these standards are met.
This will be a lengthy and costly endeavor, requiring various resources. However, our state's support for labor is unwavering.
MARGARET BRENNAN: How is the progress coming along?
GOVERNOR WES MOORE:
I've been amazed because if you would have told me nine days ago after what I saw that first morning that we could be here on this Sunday morning with already channels opened up, already ships that - up to a 14 foot depth that are now able to traverse the river and get to the port, if you would have told me that we were already starting moving - you know, we have now moved hundreds of tons out of the river. And if you look at the, you know, the fact that even just in the past few days we've received - we've removed over 250 tons from the river, that is the equivalent to the weight of the Statute of Liberty.
MARGARET BRENNAN:
Wow.
GOVERNOR WES MOORE:
And so I've been amazed at how this coordination between federal, state, local, the Coast Guard, the Navy SUPSALV, the Army Corps of Engineers, how everything is working in a synced way. And I've been very proud of the response.
MARGARET BRENNAN:
Governor, good luck with the effort.
GOVERNOR WES MOORE:
Thank you. Thank you.
MARGARET BRENNAN:
We appreciate your time today.
MARGARET BRENNAN:
And we go now to Arkansas and Republican Congressman French Hill, who joins us from Little Rock.
MARGARET BRENNAN:
Good morning to you, Congressman.
REPRESENTATIVE FRENCH HILL (R-AR):
Good morning, Margaret. Good to be with you.
MARGARET BRENNAN:
I have a lot of topics to get to, but are you open, as a Republican, to helping to vote to get help to Baltimore to rebuild with federal dollars?
REPRESENTATIVE FRENCH HILL:
Well, we had a serious collapse of the Interstate 40 bridge over the Mississippi River in Memphis. And, so, I'm completely supportive of states working with the federal government to get the bridge back up and open as soon as possible.
Naturally, insurance, private settlements with the companies, and the responsible parties all play a role. Additionally, there is the traditional federal-state split for infrastructure programs. The goal is to do whatever is necessary to ensure the bridge is repaired correctly and functioning again for the people of Baltimore.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Understood. Some members of the Freedom Caucus have expressed doubts, prompting my inquiry.
Let's now turn our attention to upcoming potential votes and expirations.
Given your position on the Intelligence Committee, you are likely aware of the law enforcement bulletin cautioning about domestic terror threats and the concerns regarding potential retaliation from Iran following Israel's recent strike. One crucial surveillance tool, 702, is set to expire on April 19th. Do you believe Congress will approve its renewal in the coming days?
REPRESENTATIVE FRENCH HILL: I am optimistic that there will be sufficient backing to extend the authorization for the use of 702, a pivotal component. Having personally witnessed the essential role that 702 surveillance plays in safeguarding America, I am confident that Congress will unite to reauthorize its utilization. However, this renewal will also encompass 50 reforms aimed at enhancing the operations of the FISA court and the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. These reforms mark the first significant changes in approximately two decades and consist of 50 bipartisan adjustments that I believe enjoy full backing from House Republicans.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And this will come up, I imagine, before we see any vote on Ukraine aid. Do you have any commitment from Speaker Johnson as to a date, a timeline, for moving aid that I know you support?
REPRESENTATIVE FRENCH HILL: Margaret, I believe that Speaker Johnson will bring up support for the supplemental appropriations for Ukraine, for Taiwan, for Israel, immediately after completing the work on FISA and FISA's extension. That deadline of April 19th makes it a priority for the first few days that we're back.
But Ukraine remains a priority, as does our support for Israel and Taiwan. And, yes, I believe he's fully committed to bringing it up to the floor immediately thereafter. And I think that's critical, as it should have been passed months ago.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You want to, as I understand it, make some changes, including attaching a provision that would allow for the U.S. to seize Russian sovereign assets and use them in the future to rebuild Ukraine. Any tweaks you make, doesn't that slow down the pathway for this to actually pass through the Senate and get to the Ukrainians who say they are running out of time?
Representative French Hill expressed his support for the Repo Act, which aims to utilize Russian sovereign assets held in Western European or U.S. financial institutions to help fill the Ukrainian budget gap. With a strong vote in both the Senate Foreign Relations Committee (20-2) and the House Foreign Affairs Committee (40-2), Hill believes this provision would strengthen the overall package for Ukraine and make Putin pay the price for his illegal invasion. He highlighted the support for this strategy from Prime Minister Sunak and others in Europe.
When asked about the possibility of Speaker Johnson being ousted for putting Ukraine aid to a vote and reauthorizing 702, Representative French Hill emphasized that Americans, including Republican voters, overwhelmingly support defeating Putin and backing Ukraine. He stressed the importance of standing against authoritarian dictators like Putin and reiterated the bipartisan support for taking action in response to the invasion.
Representative French Hill also pointed out that it is not in America's best interests for Putin to succeed in Europe or the far east, citing economic, diplomatic, and military concerns. He concluded the discussion by affirming the need to monitor the situation closely for further developments.
We'll be right back.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
Reports show that over 200 humanitarian aid workers have lost their lives in Gaza since October 7th.
In a recent discussion, Avril Benoit, the executive director of Doctors Without Borders in the U.S., joined us from New York City, while Janti Soeripto, the president of Save the Children, participated from Washington.
Our hearts go out to both organizations for the dedicated workers they have lost in this conflict. We appreciate their presence here with us today.
Janti Soeripto recently addressed the U.N. on the ongoing crisis, highlighting the alarming number of children who have lost their lives. She stated, "More children have been killed in this conflict than have been killed in all armed conflicts globally every year over the past four years."
In response, Janti Soeripto emphasized the importance of recognizing the human impact behind these statistics, reminding us that each number represents a child and their grieving family.
The conversation sheds light on the devastating toll of violence on innocent lives, urging for immediate action and support for those affected.
And Avril Benoit, I want to go to you on this because you and the people you work with provide help, medical aid, to those who are injured, who might be able to survive what is happening there.
I want to ask you, why you think we've seen this outcry this week in the wake of the killing of the seven World Central Kitchen workers, including an American, but we didn't hear the same after 225 aid workers were killed? Why do you think that is?
AVRIL BENOIT, (U.S. Executive Director, Doctors Without Borders, Msf USA): It certainly warrants an outcry, and it warrants an outcry every time these things happen. Not only have we seen so many civilians killed and injured, 33,000 killed, roughly 75,000 people injured, and it's proportionate to the population so that - in terms of the number of children, women who are injured and killed, it's very matching. And so you ask yourself, is this a war against Hamas, or a war against civilians? And among the civilians, we also have a pattern of attacks against journalists and we see a pattern also of attacks against aid workers who are there to do nothing more than alleviate suffering and save lives.
In our case, Doctors Without Borders has lost five colleagues. And they were in situations in some cases where they were literally at the bedside of patients in hospitals when they were killed.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I'll be less diplomatic. Do you think that there wasn't outcry because these aren't Westerners?
AVRIL BENOIT: No doubt the fact that World Central Kitchen, the victims of the attack, were internationals, is the kind of thing that attract morse attention. It's certainly finally attracted the attention of President Biden. And that, of course, should concern us all because every life should be considered of similar value, of great value, whether it's a Westerner or a Palestinian.
And so you can draw conclusions. We certainly are concerned about the fact that it took this attack for there to be the kind of international outcry that we've seen, although, frankly, we do think it's warranted.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
AVRIL BENOIT: There has been, in this incident, just, you know, a sense that it was just an accident, that it was an isolated event, and that is far from being the case when you actually look at the pattern of attacks on aid workers thus far.
MARGARET BRENNAN: That is why I asked John Kirby about that pattern and if there was evidence of what you say, that it was deliberate.
And, Janti, you said this week at the U.N. as well that, "this is not just about dehumanizing the victims. It dehumanizes all of us."
When you say that, are you referring to those who believe this is a distant issue that doesn't affect them?
JANTI SOERIPTO: I believe that the continuous attacks on aid workers, schools, and hospitals, as Avril pointed out, are unacceptable. There are rules in war that prohibit such actions. The destruction of homes, schools, hospitals, and the killing of innocent civilians are all violations of these rules. It is disheartening to witness this happening, and I believe it dehumanizes all of us, especially more so than the civilians who are suffering in this conflict.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Secretary Blinken outlined specific measures for aid workers and supplies to reach those in need.
JANTI SOERIPTO: Indeed.
MARGARET BRENNAN: He also mentioned the need to reverse the effects of famine. How long does it take to undo the impact of a famine?
JANTI SOERIPTO: Well, I guess the answer back is always, it depends. You know, how much unfettered access can we get? How much supplies are we going to have allowed in? It is great to hear some more outrage from the president and from Secretary Blinken. And yet, despite that outrage, the next day we signed of more arms to go to Israel.
So, you know, I would love to see some action behind those words because we're not seeing it on the ground. We are not seeing more supplies coming in. We're now hearing noises about crossings, more crossings openings, potentially better access to the north from the south, that would all be incredibly welcome. Long, long overdue but very welcome. But we have yet to see some of that really happen on the ground. And to see more details when this Erez Crossing is actually opening, for whom it is opening, when the port can be ready. But actually, there are thousands of trucks with food and water and medical supplies on the border in Rafah. I saw it myself two weeks ago. Thousands of trucks waiting. You can just let them in.
MARGARET BRENNAN: That's a political decision.
JANTI SOERIPTO: That's right.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Avril, before if let you go, your organization is asking for an investigation into the deaths of your workers. Why hasn't there been a response?
AVRIL BENOIT: Well, there hasn't been a response because what we have seen time and again for the last six months is that Israel is conducting this war in a way that completely disregards the need to protect civilians at all costs. I mean there are norms of war, the Geneva Convention's International Humanitarian Law -
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
AVRIL BENOIT: And we see systemically that this is disrespected. So, we would expect an answer on that, but just on the question of - of the famine and acute malnutrition, it's a medical condition at this point. It's a - it's a slow motion massacre of people to subject them to the kind of deprivation of food and water that they have been subjected to for the last six months. It requires a medical response, massive influx, not just of food, of trucks, of flour, of lentils, but of medicines and of trained personnel who know how to bring a child who is in complete organ failure back to health after suffering this kind of malnutrition.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Thank you both for joining us today.
We'll be back in a moment.
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MARGARET BRENNAN: Parties are gathering in Cairo today to restart negotiations to release the more than 130 hostages being held by Hamas.
Rachel Goldberg-Polin's 23-year-old son Hersh is one of those taken by Hamas six months ago and she joins us from New York.
Welcome to FACE THE NATION.
The past half-year must have been excruciating for you, enduring 184 days without your son. Yet, you've been relentless in your efforts. Meeting the pope, visiting the U.N., going to the White House, and returning there tomorrow.
What are your expectations for the upcoming meetings?
RACHEL GOLDBERG-POLIN (Mother Of Hostage Hersh Goldberg-Polin): This journey we're on is beyond words, filled with pain and uncertainty. We're desperate for answers. We're heading back to Washington to engage with various officials. We have eight American citizens in captivity for 184 days, and the anguish is overwhelming. While we appreciate the support and empathy from the U.S. government, our sole focus is bringing our people home. Tomorrow, we'll be discussing concrete actions. Six months of waiting is a collective failure that must be rectified.
As a parent, I must admit that I have not been able to protect my son. Our duty as parents is to keep our children safe, and when they are in danger, it is our responsibility to rescue them. I feel like I have failed, our governments have failed, and all parties involved have failed to bring back these 133 individuals home.
You have mentioned before that you wish mothers could be part of the negotiations. You have also pointed out that Israeli leaders may not be thinking clearly due to guilt-ridden trauma. You have urged Jewish communities worldwide to pressure those in power.
What do you need from people in their homes to support you?
Advocacy is crucial in raising awareness about the diverse group of hostages being held around the world. It's important for people to understand that this cohort includes individuals from various backgrounds and nationalities. There are Muslim Arabs, Thai Buddhists, black African Christians, Nepalese, Mexicans, Germans, French, and more. This is not a homogenous group, but a representation of global diversity.
Amidst all the noise and chaos, it's easy to overlook the individuality of each hostage. Engaging with leaders, writing to government officials, and advocating for their release is essential. While the Biden administration has shown support, the ultimate goal remains bringing these individuals back home.
Our thoughts are with you, and we will continue to follow your advocacy efforts closely. Stay strong, and we will keep pushing for answers and resolutions for your son and others in similar situations.
That's all the time we have for today. Join us again next week for more updates and discussions.
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